Andeh  /  21 Oct 2015, 20:54
Duelmania Worldwide Grand Finals, GT vs BuLaT, Friday 19:00 CEST
The grand finals between the brazilian GT and the russian BuLaT will take place this Friday (23rd) at 19:00 CEST!

Grand Finals
GT vs BuLaT
Friday 23rd of October 19:00 CEST
Best of 5

Commentary: andeh and Rikoll

[UPDATE: Twitch VOD:
YouTube VOD: ]
2015-10-21, 21:09
Damn, I'm gonna miss it. Away on holiday Should be a hell of a match. Good luck to both GT and Bulat
2015-10-21, 21:15
The most interesting duel final in recent years. I'm really impressed by Bulats comebacks vs Rikoll on dm6 and dm2. This will be a high ping nightmare for both, but: GT merely adopted high ping. Bulat was born in it, molded by it. He didn't use low ping until he was already div0.
2015-10-23, 03:01
"Ahh. I was wondering what would break first. Your Spirit? Or your packet loss?"
2015-10-23, 07:43
What server will they play on? North USA? UK?
2015-10-23, 09:40
2015-10-23, 11:32
#4: Why would they play in northern USA?

Game will be played in southern USA to keep the pings as low as possible for both players.
2015-10-23, 19:06
Very entertaining games!
2015-10-23, 23:23
Game was actually played in NYC. It took hours of research to find the VPS's and locations that had optimal submarine cable connections between continents.

Considering gt is from southern Brazil and bulat is from middle Russia, the pings were great.
2015-10-26, 15:25
Nice games! Congrats to the championship admins!
2015-10-26, 18:01
Twitch VOD:
YouTube VOD:
2015-10-26, 22:41
2015-10-27, 15:55
I have to say, this was the coolest tourney that has happened in years and years.

For once some euros finally sucked it up and played on high ping and it was proven something Australians have believed since forever.. that the best players come from the Southern Hemisphere...

2015-10-27, 17:51
euros cant do shit with high ping only 12 ping i remember old days when i played 200 ping no anti lag man it was such a thrill!
2015-10-28, 05:02
How you can call 200 ping and no antilag "thrill" is beyond me The real game is played at 0-12 ping where antilag doesn't make a difference and everything happens where it's supposed to happen. I just wish technology was there to have 12ms worldwide ^^
2015-10-28, 13:17
Rasta and I both played some duels in Los Angeles the other day (him from Amsterdam, me from Melbourne) on 180ms even and it was quite playable... as long as pings are similar plus PL is 0 and whine is 0. Play style needs to be adjusted and a solid connection is key but it was still quite fun.

Whilst in Europe I would often play on higher pings to extend the amount of opponents I would face... 90ms to New York and 118ms to Miami in particular and with ezQuake 3.0 + Antilag it is extremely playable. People are going to need to start playing on higher pings in order for QW to survive...
2015-10-28, 21:09
every ping over 40 is not playable for me. i cant adapt. impossibruu
2015-10-29, 04:14
With antilag, you can play on 52ms or even 65ms without having to adjust your game style at all. I actually find that I don't need to adjust my game style at all from 12ms up to 90ms.

Above 90ms and up to around 120ms only a slight change is needed and above 120ms is where you really need to adjust your play style.
2015-10-29, 09:58
lol! close combat with 50 ping is very hard compared to 12-28ms. and close combat with 90ms!? its all just random headbutting until someone dies. Anyways im having a really hard time with close combat with 50ms, 40 is OK, not ideal.
2015-10-29, 13:12
Antilag doesn't affect rockets... Anyone using rockets a lot and being used to 12-25 ms will suffer greatly. You can only use RL for spam and prediction, nothing reactionary or fight oriented. Same with teleporter play or rocket jumps. When it comes to fights, LG is your only hope. I for one have huge issues with LG as well though, due to the client<->server communication about knockback. I usually adjust my LG by predicting the LG-knockback and that doesn't work at all on 50+ ms.

This completely kills many players' playstyles, while it doesn't hurt others as much.
2015-10-30, 11:53
QW and QW on pings 65+ is 2 different games.
2015-10-30, 17:34
its harder and takes more skill playing on high ping cause u need alot of practice to really rock with it!!!! alot of prediction moving and prediction aiming and map knowledge is nessesary.
2015-11-02, 13:18
Even pings are not equal!
2015-11-02, 17:18
impossibru! who is this GT guy?! almost looks like he coulda win a map vs me, almost.
2015-11-02, 23:13
I can switch between 12ms and 90ms and aim rockets on both... maybe there is something wrong with you if you cant...
2015-11-03, 12:36
So you say there is no diffrent in 12ms and 90ms ping?
2015-11-04, 04:33
I can switch between 12ms and 90ms with zero effort and still aim in both....

Never said there is no difference. Most of the problem with people being 'unable' to play on 90ms is about them not giving it a go...
2015-11-04, 13:45
Not entirely true dirtbox. Your playstyle and someone elses playstyle could be very different. You can't be that narrow minded that you think just because it works for you it works for everyone else? ^.^ I've tried plenty of times to play on high ping but it doesn't work for me, I can't use teleporters and I can't rocketjump properly. I also can't LG properly due to the LG knockback being different thanks to server<>client communication.
2015-11-04, 13:50
I might also add that practicing high ping is practicing the game the way it wasn't supposed to be played. Quake is supposed to be played on 0 ping.

You won't see CS:GO or QL or SC2 players practice high ping. They practice low ping to become as good as they can at the GAME, and every game is supposed to be played on low ping.

It is only on LAN (or ping equal to LAN settings) that you will see who the better player is.

(Edited 2015-11-04, 20:07)
2015-11-04, 17:02
andeh do u ever hear urself talk? if dirtbox or i like high ping games because its a dif kind of style game let us play it!! i dont bitch about u playing 12 ping or did we ever? haters gonna hate... just chill bro everyone can play how he likes the game best! we all agree that on high ping its a dif game then on low ping.....if u dont wonna or cant handle it tuff for u sorry man!
2015-11-04, 19:55
Adrenaline, you don't seem to read before you post. I never said that you couldn't play high ping if you like it. However, DIRTBOX was the one who said that there might be something wrong with people who cannot play on high ping. And then he also claimed that it's because they hadn't given it a go.

Protip: before you comment on something, read what has been said before your post, or you will just seem stupid. You coming into this thread with unintelligent irrelevant things is just unnecessary.

...and then I remembered that Adrenaline is just a troll and that one should not pay attention to what he says

My mistake!

(Edited 2015-11-04, 20:08)
2015-11-04, 19:58
2015-11-04, 20:24
hehe alright
2015-11-04, 22:50
andeh - Actually NetQuake was designed to be played on LAN. QW was designed for high pings as an after thought to NQ because it was unplayable online with high pings

You can read about it on the WikiPedia:

I still remember when QuakeWorld was released... it was advertised as "Quake on high pings".

(Edited 2015-11-04, 22:54)
2015-11-04, 22:53
That's an arguement for every game that has an online feature. There are no games designed for high ping, at least not that I know of. Compare it to soccer, playing with one leg. Sure, there are people that are good at it, but Champions League will not be decided through one-legged-soccer.

(Edited 2015-11-04, 22:55)
2015-11-04, 22:55
I didn't hit submit on my edit until after you replied. Read up on the history of QuakeWorld's release... it was designed to enable Quake on high pings....
2015-11-04, 22:57
That is still back when pings COULD not be good. The game has developed, as has play styles (just watch an early demo... people were utter shit at the game). There are no games, nowadays, designed for high pings.

In q3 there were "InstaUnlagged" that allowed you to at least play the game with high ping, but the real games that actually determined a better player, was always played on sub 25 ping.
2015-11-04, 23:06
I think you are missing the point andeh. QW was made as an add on to NQ a long time after NQ's release to allow gameplay over high pings. This is a fact.
2015-11-04, 23:59
It was released as a means to actually be able to play online, decently.. The game itself was never designed to be played at high pings. It had an improved netcode so that if you pressed +forward, your client would actually move forward instead of waiting for the data to be recieved before your character would move forward. It introduced client-side prediction which was necessary to even be playable. The game itself was still designed for 0 ping. QW just made it possible to play with the pings that people had during that time, which would be in the 200+s.

I feel though that we are drifting way off topic. I had to respond to your claims about not giving high ping a go and that there may be something wrong with people who can't play on high ping. And then Adrenaline jumped in and trolled the thread and from there it went downhill. Thanks, Adrenaline.

Fact of the matter is though, that we said before you jumped in, some play styles simply cannot play on high ping. That is a fact, and nothing more needs to be said about that.
2015-11-05, 08:32
It would actually be extremely interesting with a big 1on1 lan to determine who is the best dueler atm. It cant be decided in games with these pings.
2015-11-05, 09:05
QHLAN 2016 Fidji Islands - every quaker attend!
2015-11-05, 11:10
why not bora bora bps
2015-11-05, 16:21
I think it would be very interesting if one could make a game commentary to understand what fights / tricks would / could have been made in low ping conditions that would favour the player that lost instead of the player that won.

Honestly, in the finals and games before, there was very little deciding fights that could change game results. Games were won on strategy, decisioning and good prediction. At least on the higher level we've seen on the latest games.

However, one can say it would be pure speculation and would still claim for a low ping game to know.

Maybe izn0 runs the TGi or we just fly non-european top 6 to Scandinavia and find the truth and hopefully some other top players that didn't play at DuelMania Worlwide could join. Who knows?

2015-11-05, 17:38
That could maybe be possible, andrestone. I'll look further into it!

I think Rikoll and LocKtar would disagree about their losses being only due to strategy and decision making. They are both confident that the games would look different were they played on 12 ms. Anyways, there's no way to prove that so it's irrelevant to talk about.

And yeah, TGI is about the only possibility of making it happen. Flying from brazil to scandinavia is most likely very expensive and a very long trip :-(
2015-11-05, 21:41
Playing with 140ms makes your gameplan a whole other story. You dont trust anything you do. you die in situations you would never be killed normaly. the ping affects everything, from aim to gameplan and fingertipfeelings and so on.
2015-11-07, 01:27
== dev
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