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Client Talk
2012-02-22, 14:37
Administrator
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Hello!

I would like to get your help in creating beginner / pro configs in nQuake.

Currently, it's aimed mostly at beginners but tries to make everyone happy.

Post the settings your would like enforced on beginner and pro setups!

Also, suggestions for different HUD elements, weapon models, textures etc are also welcome.
2012-02-22, 15:28
News Writer
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Mar 2006
I think the key is having lots of choices for both beginner and pros, and to easily swap between them in order to try them out. (Think wordpress themes, and how easy they are to try and to install)

And then just use actual configs from div1 players and from newer players, don't have to make any special configs there.

Also, I personally think a good "pro" config would be ideal for a newbie as well. (Although there are some pro configs which are not, for whatever reason, and that's a shame) For example, def's config was obviously pro, but it was simple and basic enough for newbies to use!
2012-02-22, 15:37
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Oct 2011
best hud and graphic for beginner joke.

http://img717.imageshack.us/img717/3857/2012010500001l.jpg


I think beginner it is necessary use default +- hud and beautiful graphic.

http://img69.imageshack.us/img69/2047/2012022200002r.jpg
2012-02-22, 16:26
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!phil wrote:
I think the key is having lots of choices for both beginner and pros, and to easily swap between them in order to try them out. (Think wordpress themes, and how easy they are to try and to install)

And then just use actual configs from div1 players and from newer players, don't have to make any special configs there.

Also, I personally think a good "pro" config would be ideal for a newbie as well. (Although there are some pro configs which are not, for whatever reason, and that's a shame) For example, def's config was obviously pro, but it was simple and basic enough for newbies to use!

Lots of choices doesn't go hand in hand with simple, which is what nQuake aims to be.

I was thinking that the pro config wouldn't need to download all the flashy textures and such, thus reducing the download time (and configuration/removal of files and folders).

This "pro / beginner config" stuff isn't really a very high priority for me, even if it would be pretty awesome to implement, since nQuake as it is right now is just fine for a beginner. The pros won't leave QuakeWorld due to lack of pro setting in nQuake
2012-02-22, 16:30
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I'll start with two concrete pro settings.

r_drawflat 1 (and thus removal of the fancy textures)
gl_simpleitems 1 (and removal of fancy world models/textures)

This will make the config more pro-like, and reduce download time.

How about the straight LG shaft model? Is it allowed in leagues? If so I would like it included in the pro version.

A couple of fps settings that I consider pro:

cl_gibfilter 1
cl_muzzleflash 0
cl_r2g 1 (grenade rocket models)
r_grenadetrail 1 (smoke)
r_rocketlight 0
r_rockettrail 2 (just smoke)
r_explosiontype 3 (blood)
2012-02-22, 16:32
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Mar 2006
Textures help aim by giving you more data to triangulize with. I think some pros used to use drawflat because it offered FPS improvements in the past and perhaps they are now used to it so they keep doing using it even when FPS are not longer a problem. At least that's why I used to use it.
2012-02-22, 16:35
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I use drawflat because it has less distractions. It's easier to spot enemies, items etc on a non-cluttered map.
2012-02-22, 17:32
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Mar 2006
Hmm, pro settings vs beginner (cfg to attract new players)...

For the newbs it should look at most as flashy as Quake3 not Quake4, since there are more QL players than Q4+q2+q3 combined.
I remember playing q3 for the 1st time and thought, gack all this fluff wastes resources!

But at the same time if it looks like doom 1 people are gonna choke on their mics.

just remember we all can play this game at 200+fps, so unless it is useless like the torch models (r_drawflame 0 save a lot of fps), it might be worth having.

IMHO have 2 configs, a default clean and a pro if u give a newb the pro they will not appreciate the game.

Pro:
r_fastsky 1
r_fastturb 1
gl_textureless 1
r_drawviemodel 0
ambient_level 0
cl_fakeshaft 1
...

EDIT: also no one (qw) uses r_shadows? TBH, | is harder to see than |_ (bad example) but with shadows u get a depth of area, not a fullbright 2d image, newbs need to know u can shoot the shadow and still cause dmg!
2012-02-22, 18:22
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Apr 2006
LOL!

No simpleitems!
No drawflat!
No fakeshaft (perhaps 0-0,5)

Imo really silly to sell the game by graphics and hide the feeling...
Same config overall and make the noobs appreciate the game instead,
since that has always and will always be the best thing about qw!

Jevla hittepå
2012-02-22, 18:26
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Many players will ask for such simplified "pro" settings anyway. Giving them the shortcut to quickly try them out simply lessens the burden of having to go through the 999999 settings there are and they may never even be able to concentrate on the feeling before they give up.
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2012-02-22, 18:44
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Ake Vader wrote:
Many players will ask for such simplified "pro" settings anyway. Giving them the shortcut to quickly try them out simply lessens the burden of having to go through the 999999 settings there are and they may never even be able to concentrate on the feeling before they give up.

Okey, but what you call pro settings ain't afaik any settings that any real pro uses.

QW has always been about the feeling, the one that got lost in new games that focused on fancy graphics...
Lets fix that by promoting the fancy graphics in QW with particle shaft and what not.

Simple items, well OK fine if you really want it.

The whole idea about a "beginner" and "pro" config is just plain stupid. If there should be such things then it should be the other way around:
The pros should have fancy graphics and such since they already know how to play the game, and the noobs could focus on the game nothing else.

But there ain't any pros using that kind of fancy graphics, so why would be want our newcomers to use that shit? So they feel like home from the
game they just abandoned for qw? Failure. Another failure is that they will most likely have a harder time improving with all the fancy effects (that takes
away focus from important stuff in-game).

Make the config just like a regular config that most people uses, nothing fancy at all and no difference for "pros" and "beginners".
2012-02-23, 04:55
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Mar 2006
The beginner cfg should be focused on the internal BS, like in_mouse 3 and the settings behind the gfx.
Personally im kinda pfft about the fact that the ezQuake widescreen is fixed at 16:10
which throws off that silly fov autoconfig.
give someone a cfg that they can start playing out of the box that works not some 1997 default bs, like mouse2 = +forward.

the beginner cfg should be called basic the absolute to get started TODAY. let them see all the hoha gfx just so they found the right place.
let them exec pro.cfg to swap the eyecandy out for gfx tthat make it easier to play the game... thats what opensource qw is anyways. (fullbrights, drawflat, etc)
2012-02-23, 09:54
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Apr 2007
SputnikUtah wrote:
The beginner cfg should be focused on the internal BS, like in_mouse 3 and the settings behind the gfx.
Personally im kinda pfft about the fact that the ezQuake widescreen is fixed at 16:10
which throws off that silly fov autoconfig.
give someone a cfg that they can start playing out of the box that works not some 1997 default bs, like mouse2 = +forward.

the beginner cfg should be called basic the absolute to get started TODAY. let them see all the hoha gfx just so they found the right place.
let them exec pro.cfg to swap the eyecandy out for gfx tthat make it easier to play the game... thats what opensource qw is anyways. (fullbrights, drawflat, etc)

I think im behind you on this one
2012-02-23, 11:12
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Mar 2007
What we consider"most amazing graphix ever" is not what most people consider "good graphics". I think we've been playing too long with 320x200 SW so even that Empwz's screenshot is brings the "Wow! 32-bit textures and colored lightning!" -looks to our faces.

Lets face it, compared to ie. BF3 QW does look horrible, putting too much eyecandy on QW makes QW look like a grandmother with too much makeup.

I'd stick with simple colored walls (maybe different color themes) with some particle explosions+trails to make it look more smooth.

A screenshot just to show the colored walls and trails/explosions. It's not pretty by any means
http://dl.dropbox.com/u/7561386/ezquake005.jpg


How about the hud then? Gameclock, armor, health, ammo and weapons. Pretty simple. I wouldn't use Deurks hud since the theme is not what I'd consider "quake", it's pretty though.
2012-02-23, 11:55
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A quake guy dies every time you put Q3 icons in QW.
2012-02-23, 14:29
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It can't really be considered Q3 icons anymore Kalma, it's more the "Quake Simple Items" - They are used in Q3, Q4 and QL, IMHO it makes sense to use them for new players, as they will already know the items if they have played any of the 3.
2012-02-23, 16:01
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PEKTOPAHKY wrote:
... putting too much eyecandy on QW makes QW look like a grandmother with too much makeup.

Join us on discord.quake.world
2012-02-23, 21:11
News Writer
646 posts

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Mar 2006
What about a config "Wizard" ?

A web app that goes setting-by-setting, and builds a config based on multiple choice selections.

For example:

Step 1 - r_drawflat
[screenshot of r_drawflat 0][screenshot of r_drawflat 1]
[one sentence description of r_drawflat]
[ ] radio button r_drawflot on
[ ] radio button r_drawflat off
[< back] [ next > ]

Etc.

Isolate half a dozen or a dozen important cvars like this, and put them each into its own wizard step. I think that would be very useful for building a config, along with the ezquake docs online.
2012-02-24, 05:11
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Mar 2006
I think Xonotic has a cvar list that shows a description per cvar with recommended settings.
Look at modern game though there are no console no tweakable settings. Players like to TWEAK!

New players to the ENTIRE fps scene are not like older players they are the Nintendo age, plug in a cartrige and play.
If it doesnt look feel play perfect they pass it off as crap.
2012-02-24, 07:28
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Mar 2006
ok so tell ya what is dumb, when playing KTX, there are too many settings to join a game.
/join
/ready
/color
/team
/enemycolor
/teamcolor
WTF?

Why not have all players white as obs when the game is over
then as teams are constructed force the team color that TEAM

im in mid game and i see BLue players wearing red team names and vice versa

someone says type enemycolor... wtf
so its all too convoluted for new players to get on the bandwagon when u have to swap values.
"just use the enemycolor/teamcolor" then WTF does the mod even color teams then?
OLD ass mods never get updates, too many legacy bs good luck confusing new players.
2012-02-24, 08:06
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Jan 2006
This debate is a bit insane. There MUST be a default config that will both look good and be playable, that is NOT an utopia. I think the current nQuake config is quite alright in this sense. Of course some players like to customize stuff, BUT they will do so only after they have tried the game for a while with everything on defaults. And this first impression is what matters. For customizations I still think menus are quite alright, maybe could be improved a little here and there, but that's about it. People in QW are used to "send me your cfg" when they want to start playing QW again, but that is because they know that default config sucked for at least 10 years and don't realize default values are already fine tuned for regular game play experience.

Also, r_dynamic (edit: err, I mean r_drawflat, yeah) is something absolutely not suitable for new players. It makes learning (new) maps much harder - every room has the same texture, the difficulty to tell where you actually are and whether you've already been here or not, increases.
2012-02-24, 12:31
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JohnNy_cz wrote:
Also, r_dynamic is something absolutely not suitable for new players. It makes learning (new) maps much harder - every room has the same texture, the difficulty to tell where you actually are and whether you've already been here or not, increases.

I think you mean r_drawflat?
2012-02-24, 18:19
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JohnNy_cz wrote:
This debate is a bit insane. There MUST be a default config that will both look good and be playable, that is NOT an utopia. I think the current nQuake config is quite alright in this sense. Of course some players like to customize stuff, BUT they will do so only after they have tried the game for a while with everything on defaults. And this first impression is what matters. For customizations I still think menus are quite alright, maybe could be improved a little here and there, but that's about it. People in QW are used to "send me your cfg" when they want to start playing QW again, but that is because they know that default config sucked for at least 10 years and don't realize default values are already fine tuned for regular game play experience.

Also, r_dynamic is something absolutely not suitable for new players. It makes learning (new) maps much harder - every room has the same texture, the difficulty to tell where you actually are and whether you've already been here or not, increases.

Well spoken.
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2012-02-24, 18:24
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JohnNy_cz wrote:
There MUST be a default config that will both look good and be playable, that is NOT an utopia. I think the current nQuake config is quite alright in this sense.

This is true. I setup my QW from scratch with nQuake when i started playing a couple of months ago and I had it playable in 1 hour.
2012-02-25, 09:15
Member
226 posts

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Mar 2007
I bumbed into this when I met Ozo who's really new to the game and noticed how lost he was and how some things were missing in default cfg.

-Setting screen refresh frequency
-Setting maxfps accordingly (this is pretty hard to do in default cfg i'd suppose, maybe force 75hz and ie. 300fps)
-Cl_fakeshaft 1 (i think it's 0,7 in nQuake)
-Enemyskin/teamskin/quadskin/pentskin
-mouse settings (not sure about nQuake defaults since ezQuake has some of my cfg hidden somewhere so I've trouble using nQuake's default cfg)

edit: And yeah what SputnikUtah said: join/ready/break/how to change map/gamemode etc, not very obvious.
2012-02-25, 09:59
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Um, ready / break / join / observe are available in the in-game menu (when you press Escape). Not sure why anyone would want to change their /color, only really-pro players do that.

On the other hand, sounds like there is some issue with teamskin/enemyskin/*quadskin and stuff like that? Perhaps this could be sorted out somehow?
2012-02-26, 12:29
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PEKTOPAHKY wrote:
-Cl_fakeshaft 1 (i think it's 0,7 in nQuake)

Wouldnt fakeshaft 2 be better?

Oh and enable find best routes by default.
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