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Client Talk
2010-11-29, 11:17
Member
142 posts

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Nov 2006
cl_physfps 75
cl_maxfps 675
vidlag = 0.7 ms

If i use 75 fps i will get 6.7 ms of vidlag.
Can someone explain me if the vidlag means just that.
Screen will have a delay of 0.7 ms with 675 and 75fps a delay of 6.7 ms ?
I'm not sure how exactly interpretate that value.
Is there a noticeable difference in 0.7 and 6.7 ?

Another thing, in some points of certains maps, i get a big fps drop when looking at/from a certain angle, like a steady fps drop while i keep looking at it and a 1ms delay to draw that poly.
Don't know if this is something related to my computer, or something with the maps that affect all computers.

1st PICTURE shows how while looking from that angle everything is fine.

http://img149.imageshack.us/img149/6729/ezquake000.jpg



2nd PICTURE shows the fps loss when i move the mouse a bit to the right

http://img683.imageshack.us/img683/1751/ezquake001.jpg
2010-11-29, 17:56
Member
271 posts

Registered:
Feb 2006
in all cases, remember to add ((1000/between(60,150)) + about(26) + upto(ping) + somefunctionof(ping,packetloss)) to that video delay value

the video lag numbers you're showing there are purely the video lag caused by the engine.
the difference between 1 and 6 is not too significant after all other factors are applied.

regarding your pictures, facing right results in a lot more potentially stuff on the other side of the teleporter block. there's quite a lot there that is potentially visible, especially if you were to activate r_novis. vis does not get everything, sadly, especially not entities.
moo
2010-11-29, 18:33
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142 posts

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Nov 2006
So you are saying this is normal and theres is nothing to be done here?

its 200 fps loss !!! !?

i have a gtx260, surely its not video power.
2010-11-29, 19:00
Member
485 posts

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Feb 2006
Don't be so negative. When you turn left, it's 200 fps gain!
2010-11-29, 20:55
News Writer
646 posts

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Mar 2006
Did anyone else just say WTF out loud a couple of times while reading this thread?

P.S.: I'd like optimal_video_settings.cfg please
2010-11-29, 21:26
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142 posts

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Nov 2006
Kalma wrote:
Don't be so negative. When you turn left, it's 200 fps gain!

Yes i always see glass half empty, thats why i'd like to see a glass full.

I just don't think its normal to huge fps drop just because im looking at a teleport, even if there is stuff trough the other side
That is standing and alone in server, if there are players shooting i wonder how many more fps will drop...
And like i said, happens on other maps, its not a 1 point map specific thing.
2010-11-29, 22:00
Member
284 posts

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Oct 2006
You've gotta have something really wrong in your settings cos I don't see CPU and RAM causing that much difference.

I'm running gt8800 at 1650x1050 120hz 2x antialiasing 16x anisotropy 24bit textures etc and the lowest I can get there is 540fps swinging my view between your shots. And I'm also on fov 128. Toning down FSAA and FSAF, I used to run an absolute stable 616 fps with dynamic lights etc and with a few more tweaks, I could get stable 1000fps, but I haven't tried.

And why are you using physfps 75 instead of 77? Not that it matters much here.
2010-11-30, 00:51
Member
142 posts

Registered:
Nov 2006
LCD 75hz

(This is the part you tell me it doesn't matter i can use fps i can)

i tried physfps 77 with 770fps and its not as smooth, everything that goes above monitor hz just causes tearing. since i dont think 2 fps will give me even a small disadvantage, its a trade off for complete smooth screen.

Try to position yourself in that place on aerowalk, see if it happens to you. im taking a guess but i think it might be the textures folder. will need to remove it and try.
2010-11-30, 01:22
Moderator
1329 posts

Registered:
Apr 2006
You are probably experiencing either:

1) a driver related problem or

2) misconfigured some setting in ezQuake


That particular place does drop fps a lot on my GTX 470 compared to running elsewhere (1200fps vs 2800fps when using cl_maxfps 0) but considering the fact that GTX 260 216sp has higher texture fillrate than GTX 470 the perfhit you are seeing must be something else. Sure, I have faster CPU but the difference should not be that big.
Servers: Troopers
2010-11-30, 16:21
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284 posts

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Oct 2006
MatriX wrote:
LCD 75hz

(This is the part you tell me it doesn't matter i can use fps i can)

i tried physfps 77 with 770fps and its not as smooth, everything that goes above monitor hz just causes tearing. since i dont think 2 fps will give me even a small disadvantage, its a trade off for complete smooth screen.

Try to position yourself in that place on aerowalk, see if it happens to you. im taking a guess but i think it might be the textures folder. will need to remove it and try.

" the lowest I can get there is 540fps swinging my view between your shots." meaning swinging my view between the two stills in your screenshots.
2010-11-30, 16:56
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Nov 2006
Renzo: you just said yourself you lose fps also, so it's not my driver or configuration. I may lose more due to my configuration but the fact is that it loses fps in that spot no matter what cfg ppl have.
Niomic: What is your cl_maxfps ? 616 ?


OK, so meaning this happens to others also.
I renamed textures folder, still loses fps.
I don't know if its a bug or normal issue in the map(s), but it happens when "looking" at some entity/item/texture/mdl/etc, i don't know. I don't see a logical reason for such huge fps break.

I tried again, didn't lose so many fps this time, but still big break.
I placed completely in the corner and moving mouse its clear something in the map is affecting fps alot.

with cmd r_speeds 1 you can see the time response
2010-11-30, 17:46
Member
284 posts

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Oct 2006
MatriX wrote:
Niomic: What is your cl_maxfps ? 616 ?

What does that matter? Like I said, the least fps I could get there looking which ever way, was 540, and that is with quite graphic heavy settings. I'm also running a considerably worse graphics card than you are.
2010-11-30, 19:58
Member
213 posts

Registered:
Mar 2006
i have a gtx260 216sp as well, (cpu: phenom II x4 955) and i also drop fps on that same spot, from about 280, down to about 130. i guess its low to begin with because of the models i use..

same thing standing @ GL looking @ MH, low fps. then look to your right @ the rockets/GA and fps goes back up.

drivers: nvidia 197.45

could be cfg, i have no idea, haven't tested it much.
It Takes A Tough Man To Make A Tender Rocketjump
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2010-11-30, 20:13
Moderator
1329 posts

Registered:
Apr 2006
MatriX wrote:
Renzo: you just said yourself you lose fps also, so it's not my driver or configuration. I may lose more due to my configuration but the fact is that it loses fps in that spot no matter what cfg ppl have.

Perhaps I wasn't clear enough: your gfxcard is around as fast as mine in ezQuake (due to texture fillrate and memory bandwidth, only things that matter in a game without pixel shading). Therefore you should be getting almost as much fps as I do on that particular spot.


purplehaze wrote:
i have a gtx260 216sp as well, (cpu: phenom II x4 955) and i also drop fps on that same spot, from about 280, down to about 130. i guess its low to begin with because of the models i use..

Sounds awfully low with those specs. I remember someone using spikemodels that were visible through wall and they made an awful performance hit on his computer, which wasn't bad at that time. You could try temporarily removing those models and see if it affects anything.
Servers: Troopers
2010-11-30, 20:35
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213 posts

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Mar 2006
yes i think the higher poly models converted from generations arena are a big hit on the fps. i used "r_drawentities 0" and my fps shot up to the 900s, and the difference between those two spots was 880 to 750.

i think spike is right as usual. when you stand in a corner of the map and look towards where the whole map would be (Even if there is a wall in the way) , a lot of the items are still being drawn even though you can't see them, causing the fps drop. Still, why would a few dozen entities ( in matrix' case, low poly entities) be so hard on a modern graphics card? this is where i think it comes down to a config or driver issue?
It Takes A Tough Man To Make A Tender Rocketjump
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2010-11-30, 20:45
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Apr 2006
purplehaze wrote:
when you stand in a corner of the map and look towards where the whole map would be (Even if there is a wall in the way) , a lot of the items are still being drawn even though you can't see them, causing the fps drop.

Any modern gfxcard should have pretty efficient Z-culling to tackle that issue these days. The trend of optimizing memory bandwidth and lessening overdraw started when GF3 was released.

I still think Matrix has some unresolved issue with his setup, when I had C2D@3GHz I could get better fps on that spot even with 7900GTO card.
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2010-11-30, 22:35
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213 posts

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Mar 2006
Whatever issue matrix has, i most likely have as well. i'm interested what that would be. here's my config: http://www.quakeworld.nu/configs/94/

a few things i've tried: toggling sys_yieldcpu / sys_highpriority / gl_affinemodels / gl_finish / gl_anisotropy / gl_smoothmodels / gl_ztrick / gl_hwblend /r_shadows
It Takes A Tough Man To Make A Tender Rocketjump
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2010-11-30, 23:05
Moderator
1329 posts

Registered:
Apr 2006
You could try toggling gl_triplebuffer too, just remember to use vid_restart after you do.

As for the driver, you could try 182.50 WHQL driver, if I recall it correctly I had some trouble with any driver newer than that with XP, especially with core i7 setup. Enabling/disabling threaded optimization from the NVCPL could work too, especially if you have XP and dual- or more cores cpu.

Ah, there is also a "dualcore optimizer" at the AMD website, I don't know if it's applicaple with X4 cpus but maybe worth the try if you have XP.
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2010-12-01, 00:08
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142 posts

Registered:
Nov 2006
OK, i just found out something VERY weird, prepare yourselfs:

I execute ezquake-gl.exe
type in console "gamedir lgc3" (the lgc3 bot, use search in forum for "lgc3", lgc2 topic will show up, its that one)
type in console "exec lgc3"
type in console "map aerowalk"

The fps drop is GONE completely, and with r_speeds 1 that specific poly is drawn with 0 ms now

Renzo, Spike, anyone

Explanation ?

But if i go to a online server, bug is back
2010-12-01, 00:56
Member
213 posts

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Mar 2006
matrix, that mod removes all the weapon & ammo entities from the map, hence no fps drop.
It Takes A Tough Man To Make A Tender Rocketjump
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2010-12-01, 01:14
Member
142 posts

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Nov 2006
So, the problem comes from weapon or/and ammo ?

Still don't understand how those 2 can drop fps so much


Well, i renamed all .pak in ezq and qw directory that use external models, problem is gone also, im gonna try to isolate wich model is causing this, must be a weapon and/or ammo model then.
2010-12-01, 01:41
Member
213 posts

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Mar 2006
same here, i reverted back to default models , now i'm at 880fps at the bad corner. even if it drops by 100 its not relevant anymore , i'll be using cl_maxfps 539 =]
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2010-12-01, 02:13
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142 posts

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Nov 2006
I found out the problematic file, its \qw\G_WEAPONS.pak

I tried extracting the pak, but the RL model gets screwed in game using the corresponding directories, so why does this happen ?
Without this file, i get perfect stable fps in aerowalk in that spot, on dm6 there were also few spots where fps drops happens with this file
I suppose this is the only file causing problems, since all other models don't seem to be causing issues.

purplehaze wrote:
same here, i reverted back to default models , now i'm at 880fps at the bad corner. even if it drops by 100 its not relevant anymore , i'll be using cl_maxfps 539 =]

I don't think you will have fps drops anymore regarding this issue, at least i don't drop 1 single frame now.

Side Note: I dont have only 675 fps, if i set cl_maxfps 0 i get 1120 fps in that spot
2010-12-02, 16:33
Member
142 posts

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Nov 2006
I can't get the RL textures to work using the directories and files instead of the .pak.

It should work right ?

Texture gets messed up.
2010-12-06, 12:47
Member
55 posts

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Jan 2009
That fps drop on aerowalk (2nd screenshot), standing on low-rl looking at ya is exclusive to ezQuake.
I get roughly 920fps there with ezQuake, and 1670fps with FodQuake. Exactly same setting on both clients, as far as its possible.
It's weird to say the least..
My specs:
i7 920 @ 3.8ghz. 6gb ram, gtx 275
2010-12-06, 13:03
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142 posts

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Nov 2006
The problem isn't exactly in the client, its in the G_WEAPONS.pak or some model inside.
No matter what fps people have it will always cause fps drops, you could have 5000 fps and i believe it will still cause fps drops, so i call it a bug.
2010-12-06, 13:10
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Jan 2009
Oh, nice find. Removing that pak certainly boosted the fps
2010-12-06, 13:16
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284 posts

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Oct 2006
Where is that pak from? I don't seem to have it, which would explain my very small variance in FPS in that spot.
2010-12-06, 13:17
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142 posts

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Nov 2006
MatriX wrote:
I found out the problematic file, its \qw\G_WEAPONS.pak

I tried extracting the pak, but the RL model gets screwed in game using the corresponding directories, so why does this happen ?
Without this file, i get perfect stable fps in aerowalk in that spot, on dm6 there were also few spots where fps drops happens with this file
I suppose this is the only file causing problems, since all other models don't seem to be causing issues.


Side Note: I dont have only 675 fps, if i set cl_maxfps 0 i get 1120 fps in that spot
2010-12-06, 13:17
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Jan 2009
I had it in nquake\qw. Still slightly better fps with FodQuake tho
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