Age :33
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Location: Ekerö, Stockholm, Sweden

Personality and talent within QuakeWorld.
Misc  /  13 Mar 2012, 15:27
To help or not to help
The Quakeworld scene is very small and can seem very fragile, but in fact it's been around for 16 years without dying, so I guess it's not so fragile after all. But it is in constant need of help from the community to stay alive. People like Zalon, Lornelin, the developers, tournament organizers, etc, are what's keeping it alive. I know Lornelin stepped back, but for a long time he organized QHLan etc.

Anyway, there ARE ways for the avarage quakeplayer to help the scene, without organizing tournaments or LANs.
For a scene to stay interesting, and for players to stay motivated, prizes are needed. To this day, except for QHLan tournaments, the only prize has basically been the prestige of winning tournaments. People will respect you as a dueller if you win a dueltournament, and that's always a good feeling. But when you've won tournaments, and you're amongst the top 5 duellers for example, what keeps you going? What keeps you motivated?

I played Rikoll the other day in the Besmella tournament, and I won dm4. I only did this because Rikoll didn't focus, didn't CS, didn't care. The other day, LocKtar played Lacsap (Xterm), hung over enough to be even SHAKING. He complained after the game that he was SHAKING because he was so hung over. Milton doesn't even sign up for dueltournaments. Old duellers have quit, dag, griffin, reppie, mutilator, interceptor, many who has been very good has quit playing.

So what could keep these players motivated?

Money could. It's just that simple. Prestige just isn't enough for those players anymore. And who can blame them? They've already proven themselves. They're no longer newcomers who wants to proove that they can fight against the top of the top and succeed. Money however, motivates. If you are a player who feels like you can win the 1st prize - that you can actually end up in FIRST PLACE in a duel tournament, you will be motivated to concentrate, you will be motivated to practice, you will be motivated to be in your BEST shape at your game days. You won't show up drunk, you won't show up hungover. You will have a very different WILL to win the tournament, than if there was no money involved.

This isn't a suprise to anyone. It's been said a gazillion of times.

There's a guy who tries to change all that. He wants to make this REALITY. His name is Zingao, and he's hosting the new Hymn of Hope tournament. He's throwing money into the tournament prizepool from his own pocket. This is a GREAT thing, and everyone should be thankful for this gesture.

Now he has opened a donation feature so that people who wants to help can help in a very easy way. Donations are great, since paypal is so easy to use, and since you can donate whichever value you see fit.

So why should one donate? What's in it for me?

Seriously, this question pisses me off. Sure, as the regular quaker, you might not expect yourself to make top 3 in the tournament, so you are not likely to taste the sweetness of the prizepool, but if everyone's mindset was like that, only a handful of players who feel like they have a shot at winning the tournament would donate. It's not even about that...

I'll tell you why I donate. Imagine in a good world, where people weren't selfish assholes, every player would donate say... 10 euro. That's 2 beers on the club. That's a meal at some fastfood restaurant. That's 10 euro, basically NOTHING. Even the cheapest student can afford 10 euro. Anyone can skip those 2 beers, and help out in such a GREAT way. Imagine in this good world, that everyone donated 10 euro. Let's say the tournament ends up with 128 signups. That's 128x10 euro = 1280 euro. And then Zingao adds money from his own pocket. That's a good 1500 euro prizepool. From only donating 2 beers to the qwscene. Can you imagine that? ONLY TWO BEERS each /month and we would have a tournament with a 1500 euro prizepool. I can't believe how easy it is, and how anyone can argue against this and NOT want the same thing.

This would not only motivate EVERY SINGLE dueller to practice harder, it would motivate the top players to WIN. WINNING would mean EVERYTHING. The difference between second place and first place would be in the hundreds of euros. Winning would be so important, that people would focus every game, top players wouldn't show up drunk or hungover, and trust me that Milton would sign up. If you can make 2000 euro a month from your regular day job, and then an addition 1000 euro from quake, one would definetly be motivated to win.

Just these 200 euro that Zingao puts into the tournament for the season 1 has motivated lots of players. Circle/darklord are back, interceptor is back, Milton is thinking about signing up, BuLaT is back... people are showing up for only 200 euro. Imagine if we donate more and the prizepool gets bigger... Imagine how many people would be interested in this money. Don't you think dag/griffin would seriously consider starting again if they feel they can get good enough again to have a shot at this money? Don't you think Mutilator would come back? Don't you think other div1 players would practice harder to get good enough to have a shot at the money?

All it takes to make this dream come true is for EVERYONE OF YOU to drop your hopeless mindset of hopelessnes and contribute with 2 beers a month. Of course, anyone can donate any value they want. 1 euro helps too, and so does 100 euro, but in my eyes 10 euro is a reasonable and realistic amount to donate. That's two beers a month. Can you sacrifice two beers a month? Or two packs of cig? Or skip the fastfood one day and eat something cheaper that day? Can you do that?

I know I will. The only thing I want in return is for the top players to be more motivated to win.

The question is: what will you do?

Think about it.

Sincerely yours,

Hymn of Hope tournament sign-ups
Hymn of Hope - DONATE!
2012-03-13, 15:35
finally a cash prize tournament! It's something that we should have done a long time ago!

I've already donated *
2012-03-13, 15:56
2012-03-13, 16:07

We need to start applying peer-pressure to those big names and get them to compete. Milton for one, he is active and in form... someone give this guy some valium to calm his nerves. If you see him in the server, apply peer-pressure. Anyone who knows Reppie, griffin, bulat, dag etc... call them, stage interventions, blackmail them... whatever it takes!... apply pressure!
2012-03-13, 16:09
How much money would it take for ppl who havent played for years to come back and try to end up in top3 tho? And what would they need to forsake (again) in order to be the best?
2012-03-13, 16:14
#4: I am pretty certain that a prizepool of 1500 euro does the trick. At least if they feel that they have a shot at winning.
2012-03-13, 16:26
It remains to be seen if money can keep people motivated or make old great players come back. I don't see Milton signed up yet by what you are saying he should be motivated by having a high chance of winning money. The problem is even top players have a hard time winning so realistically you need a big prize pool to highly motivate them. If it's only 200 euro and it's split various ways for instance it's not that much. QW takes a lot of time to be the best. Also look at Q3/QL it has had an almost continuous string of large money events for duel yet most of the old greats in Q3/QL have long since quit as well. I'm not sure money is the answer. Also perhaps the money would be just as well spent or better spent on buying ads on gaming sites advertising QW and NQuake to attract new players not give out money to the best ones who likely aren't going anywhere or going to stop playing QW.
2012-03-13, 16:53
Of course whether old players decide to start again remains to be seen, but investing or donating money into tournaments will NEVER EVER be a bad thing and could ONLY make things better. End of story. Whether people return though is individual to the players, and noone necessarily needs to come back. My point is that I want top players to be motivated to win. If some players start playing again, that's only just a bonus.
2012-03-13, 17:19
Watching a glass of beer is more entertaining than a round of QW 1on1.
2012-03-13, 17:38
#7 Agreed
#8 Yeah 4on4 is much more interesting and it would be nice with some money there too
2012-03-13, 20:09
#8 & #9: Luckily, the general spec consensus differs from your view. Also, splitting money between a whole clan makes the whole money aspect much less interesting. Lastly, this one for Kalma in particular, get the fuck out with your negative attitude

edit: #8 & #9, not #7 & #8

Edited by Rikoll on 13 Mar 12 @ 21:10CET
2012-03-13, 20:10
I don't know for sure Zingao can be trusted. Is there some info about him somewhere? Can anybody do an interview with him? Also, none of the names you mentioned signed up, so I don't know if money can really motivate players to join. When these two concerns are covered, I am willing to donate.
2012-03-13, 20:39
#11 JohnNy_cz: First off, I believe Zingao can be trusted, he's put alot of time into this project. WORST WORST WORST case scenario - he would take the money and disappear from the scene. You've then lost 10 euro (93:- SEK). Big deal, who the hell cares. Sure it sucks, but it's no money to talk of. Besides, what if he IS trustworthy and this thing works out great? Anyway, I think an interview would be nice too. But I'm not too fond of your mindset. :F

None of the players mentioned have signed up because 1. they don't know about the tournament. 2. The prizepool is still only about 100 euro. Also please read #7.
2012-03-13, 21:09
The problem with trust can be easily solved, tho. Some trusted and known person could maintain the price pool instead of Zingao.
2012-03-13, 21:15
Another thing is duel isn't the best investment. Without TDM/CTF/teamplay modes being played a lot there is no community. Look at the sad state of the NA QL scene, there are various top class duelers but no real community to speak off. Yet these top duelers earn major money.
2012-03-13, 21:35
I'd say something like this would be very interesting in time for the next QHLAN.
2012-03-13, 22:23
#10 Depends on how much money it is. Im glad ppl spec qw, I just enjoy 4on4 more and would like to see some money there too. Nothing wrong with that imo.
2012-03-14, 08:14
#13 It's not that we opened up this tournament on the basic of leech on the community. This feature got added because of request from the community itself. If I wanted to earn anything by lying and stealing, I would have added this feature directly and theres been 7-8 donations so far, and I'm very happy that people do trust me. I can't give any better insurence then that, but I find no reason lying for a whole community and do all this work, for just a couple of euros that any normal person could easily earn by recycle coca cola cans within a day or two.

Anyway, well-written Andeh, liked it alot, gave me goosebumps(misspell?)
2012-03-14, 08:17
#14 TDM/CTF would need a much bigger increase of cash prize, who would pay all this? 1v1 is easier to approach.

Though let me clearify something, this is a ongoing project which I want to develop for each month that goes by! I will always want to improve this, and build on it like any professional event around the esport scene does. I wont satisfy with what we got right now, I want to do more, and I will, though it will take time.
2012-03-14, 18:54
1on1 is way more exciting than any other mode to spectate imo... way more intense!
2012-03-14, 19:17
19# agreed completly
2012-03-14, 22:34
Donation made, keep up the good work...
2012-03-14, 23:05
2012-03-15, 10:36
Thank you Whimp, also your note query was very enjoyable to read.
2012-03-16, 11:35
1on1 zzZZzzZzz most boring mode ever ....
2012-03-18, 11:41
I donated 10 euros.
2012-03-18, 23:16
Ill add 50 Euros to the prize pool of this event, if 128 players will sign up!
2012-03-19, 19:55
We don't want your money, we want your videos!
2012-03-20, 14:10
okok, here you go:
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